The worst manager in baseball

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Badgers · #16 Post by **Badgers** » Thu Feb 28, 2008 2:46 pm

Sandgnats wrote:Hawk is OK. I really miss Rooney though. Farmer kind of grows on you after awhile.

Ron Santo is the guy I get a charge out of. "The way to break this losing streak is to win"

OK then!

Hawk is far from OK. I hate listening to away games against the Sox.

#17 Post by **Apollos** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:43 pm

I couldn't agree more. He did the same thing in Chgo with Prior and Wood.

#18 Post by **Apollos** » Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:44 pm

Hawk Harrelson doesn't bother me to much. Still miss Rooney though. He was the best of the Sox announcers. I think he does St Louis games now.

#19 Post by **Ghosts** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:06 pm

I think the worst manager in baseball is a 9 way tie:

Dave Garcia
Mike Ferraro
Pat Corrales
Doc Edwards
John McNamara
Mike Hargrove
Charlie Manuel
Joel Skinner
and
Eric Wedge

#20 Post by **Ghosts** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:15 pm

those Indians mangers are the worst nine in history.

Currently, the Royals Trey Hillman and Pirates John Russell (who both haven't even managed a game yet) are probably the ones who should consider putting a resume, cover letter and writing sample together because they have no chance of winning.

The best manager has to be the Brewers Ned Yost and that is mostly based on his kick ass name.

Tyler · #21 Post by **Tyler** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:22 pm

Interesting opinions, Bears. Do you have any examples or support for them?

#22 Post by **Ghosts** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:53 pm

Well, I have thirty years of watching then nine Indians managers underachieve with good and bad teams to support my first statement.

Specifically with Wedge I would point to the evidence of the choking the team did at the of the season 2 of the last 3 years. You have to blame the manager for an entire team choking.

Most of all I would point to the fact that anybody who watches the games can see that Borowski should not be the closer. Every single save was a struggle. The stats back it up...

This guy led all closers with a 5+ ERA, BY FAR the worst
in baseball.

He led the American League in BLOWN SAVES with 8, giving him a 85% success rate, one of the worst in baseball.

Opponents had highest batting average against him then any other closer in baseball BY FAR at 2.89. He had the highest WHIP of any closer in baseball BY FAR at 1.43.

As for the Royals and Pirates - The Royals may be improving but I like the Pirates of 1979 better. I mean literally right now I would take "the cobra" Dave Parker, "scrap iron" Phil Gardner, "mad dog" Bill Madlock in their fifties over these guys, hell I might even take a deceased Willie Stargell over the current Pirates.

As for Ned Yost. C'mon NED YOST!

Tyler · #23 Post by **Tyler** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:27 pm

Bears wrote:Well, I have thirty years of watching then nine Indians managers underachieve with good and bad teams to support my first statement.

Specifically with Wedge I would point to the evidence of the choking the team did at the [end] of the season 2 of the last 3 years. You have to blame the manager for an entire team choking.

This argument is brought up a lot in regards to managers. But what I just don't understand is why, if it's true, you can't simply turn it on its head and give the managers credit for, example, the amazing run the Tribe went on in 2005 to be contending in the first place.

Also, when was the second time they chocked in the past three years? 2005, yes. 2006 was just bad. Surely you don't mean the Boston series last year?

Bears wrote:Most of all I would point to the fact that anybody who watches the games can see that Borowski should not be the closer. Every single save was a struggle. The stats back it up...

This guy led all closers with a 5+ ERA, BY FAR the worst
in baseball.

He led the American League in BLOWN SAVES with 8, giving him a 85% success rate, one of the worst in baseball.

Opponents had highest batting average against him then any other closer in baseball BY FAR at 2.89. He had the highest WHIP of any closer in baseball BY FAR at 1.43.

Yeah, Borowski was terrible. But Wedge used him in the best possible manner. Think about it - all Borowski had to do in most situations was fail to give up two or three runs in one inning of work. But who was pitching in the high-leverage situations when the game was truly on the line? Up one in the eighth with a runner on second? Tie game in the seventh with the heart of the order at the plate? That'd be the two Raffies, who for my money were the best one-two relief punch in all of baseball last year.

Bears wrote:As for the Royals and Pirates - The Royals may be improving but I like the Pirates of 1979 better. I mean literally right now I would take "the cobra" Dave Parker, "scrap iron" Phil Gardner, "mad dog" Bill Madlock in their fifties over these guys, hell I might even take a deceased Willie Stargell over the current Pirates.

As for Ned Yost. C'mon NED YOST!

Actually, I think Tillman and Russell's jobs are extremely safe. Both teams are under relatively new (Royals) or completely new (Pirates) front offices. Sure, the teams on the field right now stink. But their GMs hired them knowing that, and with an eye on the development of their younger players. I'll be following both teams extremely closely (especially the Pirates, due to Neal Huntington's past work with the Tribe) and it will be interesting to see any trades either team makes. Both franchises are knowingly building towards the future.

#24 Post by **Ghosts** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:31 pm

Good points but now explain why when Bentacourt or Perez pitches a perfect 8th inning and has plenty of gas left. Wedge believes he HAS to bring in Borowski - this makes as much sense as when in '97 against the Marlins they HAD to bring in a scared Mesa for the 9th even though Anderson pitched a great 8th inning and had another in him.

I am reconsidering. I think Ken Crouch and Armando Zamora are the worst managers in baseball. (just kidding)

Tyler · #25 Post by **Tyler** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:44 pm

Yes, you're right. I completely agree about that. Rafael Perez was a starter in the minors, and Rafael Betancourt was our long man (and our emergency starter) when he debuted in the bullpen. There's absolutely no reason other than stubborn thinking that these men can't pitch multiple innings. Unfortunately, a different manager wouldn't solve this problem, as this style of thinking is systemic across almost all of baseball.

#26 Post by **Apollos** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:02 pm

Bears - I was looking at your list and did not see Baker. Do you believe he did a nice job in Chicago.

#27 Post by **Ghosts** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:18 pm

Sandgnats wrote:Bears - I was looking at your list and did not see Baker. Do you believe he did a nice job in Chicago.

As I alluded to before, there are actually 2 reps from the Bears posting. My co-manager is the one that can throw out lists of players and managers that I had never even heard off.

For Baker, that's a tough call. But the truth is I'm pretty much a Cub hater. I'd root for the Sox, but obviously never can because of the Tribe. I like Wrigley and in theory I like the Cubs, but the Cubs fans -- especially the ones in the city -- are so annoying to me (I love Wrigely! I love Harry Carey! I love drinking! I know nothing about baseball!) that I really ignore the team almost completely.

MLB.com and (maybe this year) MLB ticket make this much easier.

#28 Post by **Apollos** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:23 pm

I try very hard to be impartial on the Sox Cub thing but it's tough. Cub fans have everything and hold all the cards but they rip on the Sox constantly. I'm not sure why. They say its the Sox fans that make them that way but in our fantasy leagues they are the ones that root against the Sox. Sox fans may think it but they keep it to themselves in mixed company.

It will be curious to see how things will be when the new Cubs owner moves the team to a new stadium. Cubbies say it will never happen but I am not so sure. Do you think they will move?

Matt · #29 Post by **Matt** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:00 pm

The Cubs leaving Wrigley?????

Now there's something to chew on.

#30 Post by **Ghosts** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:03 pm

Sandgnats wrote:It will be curious to see how things will be when the new Cubs owner moves the team to a new stadium. Cubbies say it will never happen but I am not so sure. Do you think they will move?

never. it will never happen because daley, alderman, etc. would not allow it. sam zell is now running the trib, and the man is all business.

...but: i think he's just trying to scare everyone. after art modell, nothing is impossible and everyone knows it. but there's just no way they're going anywhere.